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KN5000 Midi Import Time Signatures

I am preparing a lot of accompaniment tracks for various groups that I sing in and I am having a particular problem with the time signature. I produce the tracks on Noteworthy Composer, export to midi and then load them onto my keyboard. If the piece is i…

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KN5000 Midi Import Time Signatures

paulius55

paulius55
United Kingdom

Total Posts: 9
Joined: November 23, 2016

I am preparing a lot of accompaniment tracks for various groups that I sing in and I am having a particular problem with the time signature. I produce the tracks on Noteworthy Composer, export to midi and then load them onto my keyboard. If the piece is in 4/4 time then all is well, the bar, or measure, numbers on the keyboard match the bar numbers in the piece. However, if the piece is in 3/4 time, for example, when loaded onto the keyboard it still shows 4/4 time on the Sequencer Play and consequently the bar numbers do not match the original and it is very difficult to navigate to a specific bar. If I change the time signature manually on the keyboard, it all goes horribly wrong, with respect to bar numbers. I have checked the midi header information on the midi files and the correct time signature is saved so I am presuming that the KN5000 is ignoring this part of the header. Is this a case of "tough", the KN5000 cannot read /action that part of the header, or is there some trick on midi load that I am missing?

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Posted on January 31, 2017 at 12:09 PM
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8 Replies

jd5live

jd5live
United Kingdom

Total Posts: 340
Joined: June 8, 2014

Re: KN5000 Midi Import Time Signatures

Hi Paul, I have access to a KN5000, however the symptoms you are having rings a bell , I normally use a KN7000 to play midi files but have had a number of commercial files from Europe where the files plays as 3/4 time but the sequencer is running in 4/4 time, as you say if you try and re-set the timing on the KN it all goes to pot. I got around this by setting the keyboard to the correct time setting ie:-3/4, 6/8 etc and also set the KN into slave mode then play the file from the computer via MIDI the KN5000 should record the piece and the the file can be saved to disk. I know this is a long way around but should work. I would contact the software supplier to see why you are not getting the correct time setting at the start of your file saved on the computer. The KN5000 is pretty bullet proof normaly
Regards John.

Posted on February 2, 2017 at 2:42 AM

paulius55

paulius55
United Kingdom

Total Posts: 9
Joined: November 23, 2016

Re: KN5000 Midi Import Time Signatures

Hi John, thanks for your reply. The midi files are not the problem, I believe. The correct information is held in the header, I checked that with a piece of software that strips the midi file down. It's just that the KN5000 ignores it. The manual suggests that it should be possible to add a Rhythm track to the loaded file and step record a specific rhythm into that track, this seems to work up until the point that I resave the file on the keyboard and then it loses the changes. The situation is further complicated if the time signature changes in the middle of the song. I will keep trying and fiddling.....

Posted on February 2, 2017 at 9:18 AM

paulius55

paulius55
United Kingdom

Total Posts: 9
Joined: November 23, 2016

Re: KN5000 Midi Import Time Signatures

I have found a sort of way round this problem. I load the midi file to the sequencer, assign one of the unused tracks to Rhythm, then step record a waltz to that track. I then save it to disk as Technics format (just the sequencer data), not SMF and it retains the information when it is loaded. So a song in 3/4 time now has correct measure numbers. I have not yet worked out how to change time signature in the middle of a song, as the keyboard complains and says that a rhythm already exists.

Posted on February 2, 2017 at 5:15 PM

jd5live

jd5live
United Kingdom

Total Posts: 340
Joined: June 8, 2014

Re: KN5000 Midi Import Time Signatures

Hi Paul, I know that the sequencer in the KN does not let you change time settings during a sequence, however I have an old set of styles as used by Lutz Detera on the KN800.Now I don't know if this will work, If you first load the styles into the composer Ie:- 4/4 mem 1,3/4 mem 2 ,load these also into the panel memories,you may be able to create a control track which changes the timings at the bar you want and keep the bar numbers correct. As I say I have not tried it but will have a go later tonight and let you know how I get on.
John.

Posted on February 2, 2017 at 5:49 PM

jd5live

jd5live
United Kingdom

Total Posts: 340
Joined: June 8, 2014

Re: KN5000 Midi Import Time Signatures

Hi Paul, Just tried the idea I had, BUT yes you can change the time signature but the bar number does go out of step. I can't see any way around this problem, sorry about this. It is interesting it is one fault with the sequencer, but this is the limits of onboard sequencers.
Regards John.

Posted on February 2, 2017 at 6:48 PM

paulius55

paulius55
United Kingdom

Total Posts: 9
Joined: November 23, 2016

Re: KN5000 Midi Import Time Signatures

John,
Thanks very much for your help in trying this out for me. I will have to live with the problem. I know that my KN5000 is somewhat dated but it is very special to me as it was bought from my 25 year long service award from a previous job, some years ago!

Posted on February 2, 2017 at 6:54 PM

jd5live

jd5live
United Kingdom

Total Posts: 340
Joined: June 8, 2014

Re: KN5000 Midi Import Time Signatures

Hi Paul, sorry I could not find the perfect solution to your problem, I hope you are finding the site useful , I personally have a number of things that I hope to put on the site early this year, I am looking to write part 2 of the article about Tones and how they are used in creating the rich full sounds we use in the KN models. It is quite fantastic that in 1988 the KN range started to give us a keyboard that was an arranger sequencer(with limits) composer and synth which for the time was giant step forward. The KN5000 was a fantastic instrument and still able to perform fabulous music, If anything people complained about was the limit of the floppy disk drive in what you could store on one disk, but this could be got around by fitting the Hard Disk drive, not so easy to find but well worth it if you can get hold of one second hand.
Regards John.

Posted on February 2, 2017 at 10:13 PM

paulius55

paulius55
United Kingdom

Total Posts: 9
Joined: November 23, 2016

Re: KN5000 Midi Import Time Signatures

Hi John,

I love the site and dip frequently into it. No doubt I shall make a donation in the very near future. I have got round the limitations of the floppy disk by replacing it with a USB floppy emulator, meaning I have 100 floppy disks on 1 USB key, a very worthwhile improvement at a very low cost, about £10.

Thanks again for your help

Paul

Posted on February 2, 2017 at 10:30 PM